God wishes every person to avoid hell and be saved from it (2 Pet 3:9). Christians do not believe God sends people to hell. Hell is freely chosen by those who reject God.
God gave every person the power of free will and the most important decision we will make with that power of free will is whether to embrace or reject God. Since heaven is a place where we spend eternity with God, then for those who reject God, there needs to be a place where they can escape him.
If you are a person who wants nothing to do with God in this life, then wouldn’t it be hell for you to be in heaven with God forever?
C. S. Lewis summarizes this issue well, as usual. He says, “The door of hell is locked on the inside.” All those who go to hell will to be there and to stay there. He adds, “There are only two kinds of people in the end: those who say to God, ‘Thy will be done,’ and those to whom God says, in the end, ‘Thy will be done.’ All that are in hell choose it.”
Why doesn’t God force everyone to ultimately choose him so that all people go to heaven? After all, some might say, that is the right thing to do.
The problem with this solution is that God created free human beings, and if he forces them to do anything, then he is violating their freedom. If God forces people to choose him, it comes down to a kind of “divine rape,” a coercion. God’s love demands that he offer people a place where they can freely reject him, forever.
A very well written and succinct answer to a tough question. How do you answer the fact that due to the fall, our ‘free will,’ along with everything else in our make up, was corrupted? We are certainly free to choose in the sense that our choices are uncoerced, but clearly in our fallen state, we don’t seek after God until he first quickens us.
Blessings,
Carl
True enough, Carl. But God calls on every person to receive him, so we all have a chance, regardless of our fallen nature. Even though our free will is corrupted, it is not destroyed, and God still holds us responsible for the choices we make.
Thanks for your comment,
Bill
Very well put. GOD does not send any man to Hell. That was never his goal. We send ourselves to hell when we reject the truths in GODs word. Hell Was created for Satan and his army of fallen angels.
How is it gods words? Im pretty sure the book (the bible) was written by men, over periods of time that are so vast.
Isn’t it mans word?
It’s both a human book and divine book. God inspired the human writers to write the books in the Bible, so they cooperated in its creation.
Excellent post! Love your response, too, on the question of whether or not our free will was corrupted by the fall. Some people will point to John 6:44 as a proof text for the belief that no one can come to the Father unless they are drawn, but Jesus said He would draw ALL men unto Himself! (John 12:32) As you said, everyone gets a chance. Jesus is drawing, but people have the freedom to choose to resist Him. Jesus grieved over those who rejected Him, stating that He longed to gather them under his wings but they “were not willing” (Matthew 23:37).
oops – slight typo in my last sentence: Jesus said He longed to gather people, like a hen gathers chickens under her wings
I love the CS Lewis quote. it’s one of my favorites
Actually Darrell,
I have no beef with any of that.
Guess we can’t disagree all the time.
Seth,
As much as I would like to take credit for this post, it is Bill’s. Nevertheless, I am in agreement with him on it. Nice that we see “eye to eye” on some things!!
Darrell
Where in the bible does it say that God gave us a free will. The people that will spend eternity with God are chosen by God. Those people who are not chosen by God will be cast into the Lake of Fire where they will be consumed or annililated. The people that God has chosen are eternally secure in him, no man can pluck them out of his hand. All people are either of God or of the devil. Our will cannot override Gods will for our life. It is God that makes us a vessel of honor or dishonor, for God is in control of all things to fulfill his divine will and purpose.
Hi Rick,
The entire Bible assumes that humans have free will. Otherwise, the Bible becomes nonsensical. Why?
I wondered when the 5-point Calvinists would respond.
First, if humans are not free to make their own choices, then something or someone else is responsible for human moral choices. If you say God is responsible for all human moral choices, then God is causing humans to choose both evil and good. That presents a nasty problem for you, because the Bible is clear that God is good. How can a good God be forcing people to choose moral evil?
Second, the entire Bible teaches that humans are morally responsible for their choices. But it is nonsensical to hold someone responsible for their choices if they have no ability to choose.
Third, the Bible repeatedly asserts that humans ought to choose certain things and not others. But ought implies can. It is nonsensical to tell someone they ought to do something if they can not do it.
Fourth, the Bible praises some people for their good choices and condemns others for their bad choices. It is nonsensical to praise or condemn someone if they have no ability to choose between right and wrong.
Thanks for the comment,
Bill
Hi Bill,
Let’s look at Jeremiah chapter 1 and we will see that before Jeremiah came out of his mothers womb that God had sanctified and ordained Jeremiah to be a prophet. This decision was not based on anything that Jeremiah had done.
Also the apostle Paul, in Galatians chapter 1, states, “But when it pleased God, who seperated me from my mother’s womb, and called me by his grace, to reveal his Son in me, that I might preach him among the heathen.” In both instances God chose these men to fulfill his divine will and purpose. His choice was not based on anything they did or did not do.
God is the potter and we the clay. Read Romans chapters 8 and 9. This speaks of the election of God. Some are chosen and some are not.
No man comes to Jesus unless the Father draws or calls him. It’s not our choice but our response to God’s choice that really matters for we do not choose our father. Nice talking to you.
Rick
Hi Rick,
Thanks for the response. I am very familiar with all the teachings of the Bible on election, predestination, and the sovereignty of God. I strongly affirm all of those doctrines.
The question is whether God chooses us in coordination with our free choice or against our free choice. You seem to be saying that man cannot be free and God sovereign at the same time. It is either one or the other. I deny that this is a choice we have to make. I believe that both are true. God is sovereign and man is free. Both doctrines are taught throughout Scripture. It is a mistake to agree with one and deny the other.
I agree that that God must draw any man to him or the man will not choose God. But God may draw us to him persuasively, but not coercively. God does not force people, against their will, to choose him.
Do you believe that God regenerates people without their will? Also, do you believe people freely choose to reject God? If so, where does this choice come from?
God bless,
Bill
I keep forgetting this isn’t a solo blog. Sorry Bill.
What’s stopping a reader of the Bible from concluding that Paul’s statements on predestination are directed more at the Church as a whole and not at individuals?
That’s a good point, Seth. You always have to read verses in context with the passages they are in. For example, Rom 9, 10, and 11 are speaking of the nation of Israel primarily. So verses like Rom 9:13, “Just as it is written: ‘Jacob I loved, but Esau I hated,’ are more likely referring to the nations of Israel (represented by Jacob) and the nations of Edom (represented by Esau). In fact, Rom. 9:13 is referring to Mal. 1:2-3, which seems to be clearly referring to nations and not individuals. Biblical writers often used people’s names to represent nations. This was a common practice that you see done all over the Old Testament.
Having said that, I do think there are other verses in the Bible which teach election of individuals, and not just nations. When you think about it, God is ultimately sovereign and so everything is predestined by him. But, that doesn’t mean people aren’t free.
Which verses are those?
Matt. 22:14; Mark 13:20, 22, 27; 2 Tim. 2:10; Titus. 1:1; 1 Peter. 1:2; 2 Peter. 1:10; Eph 1:4-5, 11; Rom 8:29-30
This is a very simplistic way to look at this, it does not consider the “why” we were born at all. It’s not at all easy to choose God when your life has been plagued by misery and sorrow from the start. Forced into world full of hatred and pain, disease and SIN.. A world which he created, knowing well what the outcome would be, for millions of innocent people, rape victims, the murdered. etc etc… God , created lucifer, he knew that lucifer would turn against God, God knew Eve would be deceived by him, causing Adam to fall, causing every human being to be born under a curse. God also knew that many people would live everyday of their lives in frustration for being put into a world allowed to be ruled by God’s own creation the devil, who hates God and Us and has so much power, God and the devil even had their bet on poor JOB who was the object of their game,, when GOD allowed the devil to destroy JOB’s life just to prove to the devil that JOB loved GOD.. Who cares about all the pain JOB went through all his family killed just to show the devil that he loved GOD……. Come on for some people Hell is not a choice it’s God’s creation to put people who could take all the abuse from God’s experiment..
Joe,
Do you recall Job’s response to God at the end of the book, even after all he had been through? If you miss this, you miss a major teaching of the story.
Hi folks, A shame this conversation seems to terminate at this point.
I wonder if the answer is to remove MAN and SPACE and TIME from the equation and then ask the question, “DOES MAN HAVE FREE WILL”… isn’t this where we need to start? Before Man, Space and time and ask for whom did Christ says “Here am I send me”? Isaiah 6:8
Just my opinion, but God is sovereign first right, so man being Gods creation is used to Glorify God. God weaves his will into mankind to draw elected persons to show his Grace (otherwise if all them what is grace?)… So we are ALL corrupt/evil/destined for Hell through the corruption of sin inherent in us via Adam (unless you are saying you are without sin), except God causes some to be saved for His Glory.
Dont we also acknowledge that in the first instance, Jesus died to satisfy the Justice of God. It is only once Gods Justice is satisfied that Man has any chnace to be born again into a righteousness of Christ.
So in a sense, God chooses (by his free working grace causing events to be weaved into our existence) NOT to send some to eternal Godlessness (ie Hell).
In Christ…. Satnam
divine “rape” You are kidding, aren’t you? I really hope you are kidding.
Make it simple guys.
The all mighty powerful all knowing all loving God will redeem every human and they will bow to Him. In this life or in death. All men will bow to him
if you don’t pray to someone he will torchore you for ever.
Hey Bill let’s take a look at the life of Paul before he was born again. Paul speaks of his past life in Galatians chapter 1:13-16, “For you have heard of my conversation in time past in the Jews’ religion, how that beyond measure I persecuted the church of God and wasted it. And profited in the Jews’ religion above many my equals in mine own nation, being more exceedingly zealous of the traditions of my fathers. But when it pleased God, who seperated me from my mother’s womb, and called me by his grace, to reveal his Son in me that I might preach him among the heathen”. According to Paul in Romans 8:29, “For whom he did foreknow, he did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren. Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called; whom he called, them he also justified, whom he justified, then he also glorified”. When Paul was Saul he was antichrist or against Christ. He claimed to know God through the teaching of Moses but if he truly understood the teaching of Moses and the prophets then he would have known that Jesus was the Messiah that was to come. Even though Saul was not born again, he was chosen of God from the foundation of the world. He was an unborn Son of God waiting to be born. When he came face to face with the Word of God (God’s call to Saul), he responded with a yes in his heart and was obedient to the call. He was then born from above. God changed his name and he was now God’s son. The call is the preaching of the Gospel. This call is to go to all mankind, though only the chosen of God will heed the call and be drawn by the Father to Jesus. Jesus told the scribes and pharisees in John 8:43,”Why do you not understand my speech? I’ll tell you why, it is because you cannot hear(understand) my word. In John 8:47, Jesus tells them,”He that is of God heareth(understands)God’s words: ye therefore hear(understand)them not, because ye are not of God. So these men were never going to be born again because they could not understand the word they heard. That was the call to them and they responded not. Do you really think that God would put the responsibility of salvation in mans hands. If God would do this it would not be by grace. Salvation is all about God sovereignly saving some of mankind. It is Gods’ choice. Sincerely Rick
Hi Rick,
I understand exactly what you’re saying and I appreciate your points about God’s grace. I believe God unconditionally offers salvation and calls all men to Him. He doesn’t offer salvation based on what man will do, as if God is waiting on men to make their decision and then he ratifies it. However, men are free to accept or reject his offer. You said yourself in your comment that Paul “responded with a yes in his heart and was obedient to the call.” If Paul responded with a “yes,” didn’t he have a choice?
I want to ask the same questions again, from my last comment, because you have yet to answer them, at least I can’t tell that you have. Do you believe that God regenerates people without their will? Also, do you believe people freely choose to reject God? If so, where does this choice come from?
Please try to answer these questions for me so that I can better understand your position.
God bless,
Bill
Good afternoon Bill! You asked me if I believe if God regenerates people without their will. My answer would be no. God predestines, chooses, preplans, predetermines, or whatever word you want to use, those people that he wills to be born again. He made this decision before the world was formed. He also determined that Jesus would be slain for the sins of the world before the world was formed. God set the time when Jesus would be crucified and when the fullness of time came it happened. The same thing happens when a person that is chosen by God to be his son is born again. God determined they would be his and set the time when it would happen. When that time comes, they are born again. How does regeneration happen? God sends his word or calls them. This call is the preaching of the gospel or good news about what Jesus did for us on the cross. This call goes out to all people. Only the people that God has chosen or elected will hear or understand the message of the call and obey it. The call is the Word of God. The Word of God is a seed. An incorruptible seed. When a chosen person receives this seed, by hearing, believing, and obeying it, the seed is then planted into their heart and from this seed God births a holy spirit is us. This is being born from above. The chosen of God are truly in this world but not of it, just as Jesus was not of this world. I would not say that people choose to reject God but if they are not chosen of God they will not hear or understand the call of God and will not believe and obey the call. Jesus said that if a person was not of God that they could not hear God or the call of God. Bill, if you need scriptures to explain what I just said, please let me know. Later, Rick
Hi Rick,
Thanks for the reply. I’m a little confused by it, though. You said in your first couple sentences that God does not choose people without their will. But then you described the process of a person being born again, and all throughout that process, as far as I could tell, the person’s will actually played no meaningful role. God decided they would be elect, He made sure they would hear the word, and when they heard the word, they automatically responded to it, as if they were pre-programmed. If I have mischaracterized what you said, please correct me, as words often fail us in these discussions.
But if the elect person if pre-programmed to respond positively to the call of God, then where is their will involved? And why didn’t God pre-program the non-elect to respond to his calling? Is the non-elect person responsible for not believing in Christ?
Great discussion – thanks for having it with me.
Bill
It’s another day the Lord hath made I will rejoice and be glad in it. Hi Bill. I don’t know if I am explaining myself to where you can understand me, so I’m going to list some scriptures for you to read. Let me know when you have had time to read and study them, then we can discuss them. Here are the scriptures:Jeremiah 1:4-10, the entire book of Jonah, John 6:22-71, John 8:21-47, John 10:22-30, John 14:6-11, John 15:16-21, John chapter 17(all of it), Acts 7:54-60, Acts 8:1-4, Acts 9:1-22, Romans 8:28-33, Romans chapter 9(all of it), Romans 11:25-29, Galatians 1:11-17, Ephesians 1:1-14, II Thessalonians 2:13-17, II Timothy 1:8-11, I Peter 1:1-5, I Peter 2:9, Revelation 17:14. Enjoy studying these passages of scripture. Think about the process of election or being chosen. Here is an example: you and I are captains of a basketball team. Both of us are going to choose 4 people to join us on our team. We are in total control over who gets chosen. There are 100 people to pick from, so you see that not all will be chosen. Our choice is not based on what they have done but is strictly our choice. They did not have to do anything to be chosen. We are in control. This is God. Either he is in control and sovereign or he is not God. Have a good day! Rick
Hi Rick,
I have read all of those passages and some of them many times. Our friendly disagreement is not based on the fact that you have read the Bible and I have not. Our disagreement stems from our interpretations of these texts.
Given your example of the basketball team, you are arguing that man’s will is not involved in his salvation, however you said the opposite in your previous post. Which is it?
And why didn’t God choose everyone for the basketball team? Are those who weren’t chosen for the basketball team responsible for not being chosen? Is it their fault they weren’t chosen?
If you’re not comfortable answering these questions, that’s OK. But these are the exact questions you need to be able to answer to convince people that your intepretation of the Bible is correct.
God bless,
Bill
Hi Bill, In response to your three questions, my answers are: God chooses who he will, those that are not chosen are not responsible for not being chosen, and it is not their fault for not being chosen. Let me bring up a different scenario since we are talking about a persons will. Do you have any children? I have two. Let’s say you were having company over for the weekend and you wanted your house to be clean. You tell your children to clean up their room and you will come back in an hour to make sure that it is clean. An hour later you enter their bedroom and see them sitting on their bed playing video games. The room is not clean, in fact, it is a bigger mess than it was before. What do you do? A. nothing B. You discipline your children and make or force them to clean it or C. do something else. With this thought in mind; can God, or better yet, would God, in order to accomplish his will, make or force someone to do something against their own will? Yes or no. Does God’s will override our will or vice versa?
Hi Rick,
If God chooses who will be saved and those who are not chosen are not responsible for their not being chosen, then how do you explain hell? It seems that God absolutely holds people responsible for not being chosen (they end up in hell, which is not a nice place). In essence, you seem to be arguing for a God who arbitrarily chooses some to go to heaven and some to go to hell, and those who go to hell have nothing to do with going there. Do you really mean to say this? Do you mean to say that those who go to hell have done nothing wrong and are not at all responsible for their destination? It was just God’s choice?
God Bless,
Bill
Glad to here from you again Bill. If it were not for Gods’ grace all of mankind would perish in hell. For all have sinned and come short of the glory of God. Man was in a hopeless situation until God stepped in. God did so because of his love for mankind. With his love, grace, and mercy he had a plan before he ever made this world. Gods’ love extends only to those that he has chosen from the foundation of the world. Did God choose all people to be saved? I say no. If he did then all people would be saved. Gods’ will and purpose will be accomplished with mankind. If I walked into a crowd of twenty people and chose to give one hundred dollars to five of the people would the other fifteen people be upset. Probably but they have no right to be upset. I did not owe anyone anything but it was out of my grace that I gave the five the money. It was my choice who would receive or not. I was reading one of your other articles and you said that unsaved man could not choose God. That is correct. Salvation is a gift from God to people that God chooses to draw to himself. God paid the ransom price for man by giving his son Jesus to die on the cross for man. God then chooses the people that he wants to be his sons. He then gives them the ability to hear his word or call. He then calls them or draws them to himself through the preaching of the word. He gives to them the gift of faith so they can hear, believe, and receive his word. All of this is done by the grace of God and has nothing whatsoever to do with the man. Why did God choose to do it this way. So he would get all the glory. If man chose his own salvation then man could brag about it. It has nothing to do with what man does. All the glory of salvation goes to God who is worthy of all praise. Good night! Rick
Hi Rick,
Thanks for the response. I would still like to understand the fault of the man who God does not choose. The man who is not chosen is going to hell, so do you think that man deserves to go to hell? If so, why? Also, do you believe God is all-loving? If so, how do you reconcile the fact, under your system, that he could save everyone, but he does not?
God bless,
Bill
Hi Bill, I am not sure what you mean by an all-loving God. Does God hate anything? Psalms 5 states that God hates the workers of iniquity. Even Jesus told the workers of iniquity to depart from him. Do you not believe that God can do to man whatever he chooses to do? He hardened Pharoahs’ heart in order to get him to do what he wanted him to do, so he could show forth his glory. I am not trying to say that God is a hateful God but simply a God that is in control of his universe. Whatever God has set and planned to happen will happen. God may not get the response he desires from us at first but he will not stop until he does. He will simply put us in circumstances that will work us until we see things his way. He did this with Jonah until Jonah obeyed him. If God chooses you, he will conform you through the circumstances that he puts you through. Trust me, I know! Rick
Hi Rick,
The Christian church has always held that God is all-loving (omnibenevolent). 1 John 4:16 states that God is love. Your view states that God only chooses some and not others. He could choose all, but he does not. But why does he not choose all if he is all-loving? How do you explain that in your system?
Rick, I also don’t understand whether you think the man who is not chosen deserves to go to hell (after all, that is where he is going). If he does deserve to go to hell, then why? I’ve actually asked this question a few times, but I can’t get an answer out of you!
Thanks so much for our conversation. I enjoy learning other people’s views!
Bill
Hi Bill, Your question was,”Why does God not choose everyone if he is all-loving? I still do not know what you mean by all-loving. God chooses whom he will. What did you or anyone else do to deserve to go to heaven? What did anyone who goes to hell do to deserve going there? All of mankind at one time was deserving hell because of the iniquity of Adam. God chose to redeem a remnant for himself. Let’s look at Romans 9:11-23. This is not my view but Gods’ view. 11)For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth; 12)It was said unto her, The elder shall serve the younger. 13)As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated. 14) What shall we say then? Is there unrighteousness with God? God forbid. 15)For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion. 16)So then it is not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that showeth mercy. 17) For the scripture saith unto Pharaoh, Even for this same purpose have I raised thee up, that I might show my power in thee, and that my name might be declared throughout all the earth. 18)Therefore hath he mercy on whom he will have mercy, and whom he will he hardeneth. 19)Thou wilt say then unto me, Why doth he yet find fault? For who hath resisted his will? 20)Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it, Why hast thou made me thus? 21)Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour? 22)What if God, willing to show his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction: 23)And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory. I think this says it all. Rick
Hi Rick,
I am very familiar with Rom. 9, but you are using it out of context. Paul is speaking of national Israel in Romans 9, 10, and 11. He is not talking about individual salvation. Paul is explaining to Jews in Rome how it is that their once-chosen nation could be set aside for the Gentiles. Again, Paul is not speaking about salvation of individuals. Jacob and Esau refer to the nations of Israel and Edom, respectively, as is clear when you go to Malachi 1.
Additionally, you still have to deal with the rest of Scripture that over and over again holds men responsible for their acceptance or rejection of God. By your system, not only is man not responsible for heaven, but he is not responsible for hell. Let me restate that. Men are sent to hell, a place of eternal damnation, for no fault of their own! Doesn’t that bother you??
I think the reason 5-point Calvinism seems so wrong to many people is that it has God arbitrarily choosing some for heaven and some for hell. How can an all-loving God choose some people to go hell and never give them a chance to accept him? 5-point Calvinists deny that God is all-loving. He loves some and he hates others.
John Owen (5-point Calvinist) bluntly confessed, “God, having ‘made some for the day of evil’ … ’hated them before they were born’ … ‘before [He] ordained them to condemnation.’ ”
Norman L. Geisler, Systematic Theology, Volume Three: Sin, Salvation (Minneapolis, MN: Bethany House Publishers, 2004), 567.
Puritan theologian William Ames (1567–1624) affirmed, “There are two kinds of predestination: election and rejection or reprobation.” He added, “God hates them (the non-elect; Rom. 9:13). This hatred is negative or privative, because it denies election. But it has a positive content, for God has willed that some should not have eternal life.”
Ibid., 567.
I cannot understand a God who loves some and hates others, who sends men to hell without giving them any chance to even choose him. It is not biblical and it does not make rational sense.
Having said all that, I still consider you a brother in Christ, although a misguided one.
I pray that you will continue to think about these issues and try to deal with the many problems I’ve raised.
God bless and good night,
Bill
Hi Bill, How do the following scriptures fit an all-loving God? Psalms 5:4-6)For thou art not a God that hath pleasure in wickedness: neither shall evil dwell with thee. The foolish shall not stand in thy sight: thou hatest all workers of iniquity. Thou shalt destroy them that speak leasing: the LORD will abhor the bloody and deceitful man. Psalms 28:3-5)Draw me not away with the wicked, and with the workers of iniquity, which speak peace to their neighbours, but mischief is in their hearts. Give them according to their deeds, and according to the wickedness of their endeavours: give them after the work of their hands; render to them their desert. Because they regard not the works of the LORD, nor the operation of his hands, he shall destroy them, and not build them up. Psalms 37:1,2)Fret not thyself because of evildoers, neither be thou envious against the workers of iniquity. For they shall soon be cut down like the grass, and wither as the green herb. Psalm 59:5)Thou therefore, O LORD God of hosts, the God of Israel, awake to visit all the heathen: be not merciful to any wicked transgressors. Selah. Psalm 92:7) When the wicked spring as the grass, and when all the workers of iniquity do flourish; it is that they shall be destroyed for ever. Proverbs 10:29)The way of the LORD is strength to the upright: but destruction shall be to the workers of iniquity. Once again, what do you mean by an all-loving God?
Hi Rick,
See quote below:
‘If “love” is defined as “willing the good of its object,” then for all practical purposes “love” and “goodness” can be treated synonymously. Literally, the word omnibenevolent means “all-good.” Biblically, the basic Hebrew term for “love” (chesed) used of God means “goodness,” “affection,” “good-will,” “loving-kindness” or “tender loving-kindness.” The Greek word agape used of God’s love means “benevolence,” a self-less “sacrificial” love. Theologically, God’s omnibenevolence refers to His infinite or unlimited goodness.’
Norman L. Geisler, Systematic Theology, Volume Two: God, Creation (Minneapolis, MN: Bethany House Publishers, 2003), 367.
The church has always held that God’s love is totally compatible with his hatred of sin. As a parent, I unconditionally love my children, but I hate their sin. There is no issue with a God who is loving and just.
A God who loves all people would not choose some people for hell, and never give those people a chance. Additionally, Calvinists believe that God irresistibly draws the elect to himself, against their will. Forced love is a contradiction. You cannot force a person to love you.
By the way, if you would like Scripture or church history to back up the all-lovingness of God, let me know. I can provide them.
God bless,
Bill
It’s me again Bill. I have only one question for you this time. What is the difference between forcing someone to love you or commanding someone to love you. The expectations are the same. God commands that we love him. Jesus said that if we loved him we would keep his commandments. He said that the greatest commandment was to love God with all your heart, mind, and soul. This was not a suggestion and there were no options. We, the chosen of God, have been commanded to love God. I am just glad I have the privilege to have been called through the preaching of the gospel which to those not chosen is foolishness. You are chosen to, Bill. Rick
A command is a way of one person telling another what to do, or what is expected of them. God does, indeed, tell us to love him, as he tells us to do many other things (although that command is the most important).
But telling us what he wants us to do and forcing us (without our cooperation and against our will) are two completely different things. If I command you right now to stop believing 5-point Calvinism, you are not forced to do it. I may try to reason with you, show you that I care about you, and try other ways to convince you. But, at the end of the day, you are free to decide as you will, and I cannot force you to believe.
In the same way, God’s grace moves in all men to convince them of their sin so that they will believe in his Son. God woos us to himself, but he never holds a gun to our head, and says “Believe or else!”
There is a huge difference between forcing someone to do something and telling someone to do something.
One additional point. You said: “We, the chosen of God, have been commanded to love God.” Don’t you really mean that all men have been commanded to love God, not just the chosen?